hello everyone and welcome to American Thought Leaders now today our very
special guest is senator ran Paul
he's the ranking member of the Senate Homeland Security and government Affairs Committee and of course
also the author of the amazing new book
deception the great COVID coverup senator Paul so good to have you
grad to be with you thanks for Havering you know just very recently you
were in a hearing where you did some oversight or hound
pretty serious free speech issues of FBI director ray and j's Secretary Mayorkas what
do you feel can come of this
you know to me it's pretty important that we not have our government participating
and showing up at the offices of people in the media and saying
what you're saying is disinformation you can't say that to me is a clear
violation of the First Amendment
that's what this case Missouri versus Biden is about basically they sued and said
the FBI and the department of Homeland Security should not be allowed to show
up weekly at Twitter and Facebook and have things taken down
in the book we talk about this because the theory that the lab the
virus leaked from the lab in Wuhan
was suppressed by Facebook for over a year but the question is
it being suppressed at the behest
of government and this is essentially government using its arm of government
to stretch out and then
use private industry to be their sort of outsource censors
so this is a big problem and something that I continued to fight I
addressed it with Mayorkas and with
director ray last week and neither one of them seemed to even be willing to admit
that they were having the meeting
but right now they're forbidden from adding the meetings and director ray from the FBI finally
admitted yes we're not having the meeting
but I don't know if that's good enough I've been trying to get the
minutes of those meetings and I want to know exactly what's discussed
and you know what kind of things the government is trying to
do to prevent speech from occurring
but one of the things that came out in Missouri versus Biden
is there's a lot of
you know yeah you could call it cajoling or you know so med of the
implied you know regulatory effect that might happen if you don't do the thing that I
need you to do and that's
you know that can be viewed as similarly to actual giving actual direction
right but can you imagine if the mainstream media that doesn't seem to care about this
issue ABC George Steffan Hipple whatever we have an interview and after the interview
he has a meeting with the FBI and the FBI says we
want to review the tape
and these things that came out in the interview we think are
misinformation and should be excluded
they would be horrified they would immediately realize that's an infringement even
if it was just a suggestion
we think you might want to or we've looked at your content
mediation rules and we think this doesn't fly under your own rules maybe you might want
to consider removing this from the interview
ABCNB CCP would be horrified by this
and yet they don't blink an eye when this is happening at Twitter Facebook and all
the other YouTube across the spectrum
well I think you've probably at this point looked at congressman Jordan's new report
with the weaponization subcommittee it's the weaponization of disinformation pseudo experts and bureaucrats
I things is the title I mean that shows a level of let's say
coordination even pre 20 20 election a have you looked at this
yes and we're continuing to look at it and we're working closely with Jim
Jordan on this we have a bill
to try to fix this the free speech Protection Act
and Jim Jordan is the lead in the house and I'm the lead in the senate
and our bill would basically make it illegal for the FBI or department of Homeland Security
or the White House or the CDC
it would be illegal for them to meet with anybody in the
media not just internet companies
but anybody in the Legacy media as well or the print media
it would be illegal and they would be fired if they were found to be meeting
to discuss Carole compel coerce
or any kind of kind of discussion to limit
constitutionally protected speech and we decided to use the word in constitutionally protected speech
because the FBI pushes back and says well we talked to him about taking Downchild pornography
well that's against the law child pornography it's not constitution in protected speech so
is a good way of
trying to divide out what the government can and cannot do
because Christopher ray pushes back says well we go after we talk to Facebook about putting
terrorist posts people are recruiting come for Hamas we want that taken down
but we're not objecting to stopping people from joining a violent group
so there are limitations on speech but there is constitutionally protected speech
and me telling you that masks don't work or that your child
doesn't need a vaccine for COVID
that is my opinion based on the way I have seen the signs
but that is constitutionally protected and in no way should the FBI
or department of Homeland Security
or some outsource project to Stanford or some other or Berkeley
be allowed to coerce them to take down my speech
well let's jump into deception because you know a corps element of the deception was incredibly
significant censorship but actually more than that
because it was the ability of the mechanism that can manufacture almost perceived consensus among us
that something like a labralikue is just a toxic idea we're not
even allowed to think about that
why don't you just give me the thesis of the book like what will
people discover when they read it
I think what is mine barking about this coverup is how extensive it is
and how virtually everything they said in private they said the opposite in the
public at the same time
now some of them will say oh our thoughts evolved and we were playing
devil's advocate at this time and now you know we have discovered this
it's not so in February 1st of 2000 and 20
Fauci and a group of scientists got together both by bone call zoom skype
and they have a meeting
and in that meeting they all conclude and in Fauci's word he writes the
summary of the meeting he says
we've looked at the genetic sequence of the virus
it looks manipulated it looks like it's been manipulated purposely in a lab to
make it more infectious for humans
and we're doubly worried because we know that lab
in Wuhan does gain a function research Fast Forward a year later
publicly to me he denies
fervently that there's any kind of that
has ever a funded gained a function in Wuhan so what he says in private the
opposite of what he's saying in public
and this went on throughout the spring of 20 20 and then it turns
out the scientists that are organizing many of these things are actually the scientists
that we're funding the lab in Wuhan
they actually have a direct conflict of interests because they are the
ones that will be culpable
same with Anthony Fauci why is he so wedded to trying to make you believe it
came from the animal Kingdom and not the lab cause he funded the lab
if it comes out that he funded the lab and that's where the pandemic arose
there's a certain amount of culpability he has for the pandemic
so they are doing everything they can to escape any kind of attachment to
that money or to gain a function
because it attaches guilt for the pandemic them what you say is the most surprising thing
that you've found and I mean your you have a lot of skepticism about
how all these systems work but what would you say is the most surprising thing
how extensive the coverup was want just Anthony Fauci and a few
scientists that it reaches throughout
probably eight different divisions of our government eight different departments of government
that this has been going on a long period of time and they're still hiding this
that most of this is non classified and still being hidden
you know we finally got Democrats to agree unanimously in the senate and in the house
to declassify all the Cube and documents
and for Biden to reveal them since that we've gotten zero pieces of information from Biden
most of the stuff is already to classified
they are hiding declassified material HHS
and NIH have been more secretive in and hiding more stuff than the CIA does
we've had more forthcoming meetings with the CIA and the FBI and
the department of energy than HHS
we've been asking for documents and they'll send us 250 page document with everything redacted
we finally got the Democrat chairman Peters of the Homeland Security design letters
and he signed letters four months ago and we've still got no document
so this is really a massive coverup and I suspect it's because there's many
more links to the funding
and there was probably discussion of the funding one of the colossal things that
Fauci did that led to all this
is that Fauci decided not to have the Safety Committee look at this they
went around the Safety Committee
the money goes to Wuhan and the Safety Committee never reviewed it
and who he say he says why I had dozens of scientists up and down who
told me it wasn't gain a function
well then we should see the minutes of those meetings where the discussion happened
I want to see the discussion over
was it safe or unsafe to send this money to Wuhan and if he says all
my scientists told me it wasn't
I want to see the dialogue I want to see the arguments the scientists made for
why we should have been doing
this dangerous research in a total during country
in a lab that was of a lower safety level than almost every scientist
in the world agrees they shouldn't have been dealing it there
and then to make matters worse when it finally happens when the accident happens
you know China of course covers all of it up and won't admit to
anything it took them three months to admit that there was
a contagion and even then they said it wasn't going people to people for another two
weeks until they couldn't deny that
so at every step of the way there's been a coverup that began in China
but the surprising thing was how extensive it is in our country
and how our country circled the wagons to prevent knowledge
much as they do in a totalitarian country like China
yeah I mean it's absolutely astonishing you know you had a
pretty unique role that you played I think
because by my observation Dr Fauci was incredibly effective at avoiding kind of having
in public to speak with anybody
who might challenge his view you know he said you know I am the
science these kinds of things
of course you actually you know challenged him publicly and perhaps had the
had the I don't know intellectual maturity to not be intimidated by him because
he is actually very intimidating
can you tell me a little bit about that experience and just was there
anything unexpected that came of that
you know we write about this in the book when I started out with
Dr Fauci I was completely neutral
I had no opinion of him I really frankly had never heard of him
other than a few press conferences
the first meeting I have with him in the first exchange I
ask him whether or not steroids
might be used in the very sick COVID patients to rescue them from death
and he proposed it and said we've looked at that and it doesn't work
what turns out a year later and towards the end of the pandemic
the scientists have discovered that the one treatment that saved 36 percent of the
people reduced mortality by 36 percent
for very sick people were my people in the ventilator or close
to the ventilator wish Ivy steroids
so he was completely wrong on that was my first indication that he was not a
truth Teller or that he wasn't very competent
but then about a month later were in the spring of 20 20
the data coming out of China is that kids aren't getting sick
and they aren't dying from this
and I challenged him with it because they're already beginning to lock down the
schools and become hysterical about children
and I challenged him with the issue of children and once again
he goes off on a track
it sounds like sort of the CNN oyster hysteria track
and he goes off saying oh kids are dying from multi organ failure now
so and it just wasn't frankly true
when we look to the statistics it turns out that kids who die from
this Kawasaki type of disease
that you can sometimes get in post viral situation turns out it was less than it
was before the pandemic and COVID doesn't have an increased rate of that
but that's the kind of stuff he would mouthpiece just to scare people to get people
are able to accept his edicts of lockdown
at senator Paul you know he said I think pretty clearly in one of
these oversight hearings that he was not funding gain of functioned research
I mean I think you present an incredibly developed evidence in your book that there was
again functioning research being funded I
so are there any ramifications of this or what it would how do you
see this contradiction seeming contradiction
you know it's against the law toly to Congress so we've referred him to
merit Garland to the Attorney General
we have had a lot of luck mari Garland's not paying attention to the referral
but he did lie to Congress and there were many people under the Trump
Administration that they went after and they
arrested them at seven in the morning and they're underwear and drug them out
in front of their families with
17 20 FBI agents so they have arrested people for lying to Congress before
but it seems they won't if it's one of their own
and this is a real problem on whether or not it was again function
if you take two viruses and you take the genetics and you combine them to create
a virus that doesn't exist in nature
and it's more lethal or more infectious that's gain a function it's
no more complicated than that
but if Anthony Fauci were sitting here he'd say well bat viruses can't be
gained to function it can only be human viruses well who says that
and it didn't say that in their definition but we do know that when
I was debating him over this
the day before his next testimony that he came before us with
they changed the definition they simply went on their website and typed in a new definition
to try to define a way
gain a function in fact they don't even use the words gain a function anymore
so they've really it's always been about trying to escape from the truth and
obscure their role in this
and it's all an elaborate coverup and they're all self interested
and this is the main thing that the mainstream media doesn't get
they think he's a disinterested scientist
who just wants what's best for the country and he's a grandfather figure
he wants to cover his tracks cause he doesn't want history to judge
that a pandemic came from a lab that he that he funded but he's not going
to get away with it I think overtime
you know in 20 20 he was getting away with it an
early 20 21 he wasn't
but then many people started writing about it and I think ours is a
great compendium of all of that but there's another book viral
by Elena Chan a scientist with Matt Ridley that was a great book on this
Alex Berenson is written on this there's a book by Sherry marks and whatever
happen what happened in Wuhan there's all kinds of Great Books on this
and so I think history's going to treat him much more a severely than he thinks
and my goal though is not just about his judgment in history
my goal was to try to prevent this from happening again because
they are working with viruses that have fifty percent legality
if they make a virus like ebola aracilize where it spreads through the air
and it escapes from a lab
they could kill half of the world so this is this is a discussion
to me that's as important or more important than nuclear weapons
and it needs to be treated that way and the reform will have to be that
we're gave to treat this research as if we were talking about enriching uranium
I mean this is a big deal that has to have many more safety protocols on
or we're going to suffer this same thing but could be much worse the next time
senator as we finished one quick question something caught my eye in the book and I'll
just read it to you very quickly
to those who disdain the monicur deep state they fail to understand the nature of the
epithets as we finish can you quickly explain the nature of the epithets
I think the left thinks that by deep state we mean evil men running
their hands through the gold sangha a we're doing this and enriching ourselves
whereas the deep state really is maybe more mundane the deep state is
the longevity and Fauci would be a great example of this decade
after decade President after President
who develop their own sort of policy preferences within government they're not elected
but they form something that becomes the deep state and the apparatus
that is a government of its own in essence and it's part of the executive branch
because the executive branch has grown
and the legislative branch hasn't tackled this or tried to limit it
but the deep state is out there and the deep state has its own incentive in
its longevity and it's not getting naked
so the deep state is at the heart of this conspiracy
but it isn't that they that some of them don't even know each other some of
them have never met each other
but the thing is if you've funded research in China
and if was gain a function or looks like gain a function research what
do you think they're doing right now
they're trying to hide it from me and they're trying to hide
it from the American people
even though they've never met each other so there are hundreds of people
it George Carlin the comedian put it back see said conspiracy theories
are not necessary where interests converge the interest converging is if you
funded gain a function research
you're busily trying to hide it from the American people now
and I'm steadfastly trying to get that exposed and I'm into continue
well senator Rand Paul it's such a pleasure to have you on thank you thanks foreign
con I in the MIA ten I an